【在线交流】对虾苗种繁育及养殖场管理@Dr. Matthew Briggs，6月18日下午16:00

夏天的雨

育苗与养殖很大的差别就是，育所以苗场内环境是基本可控的，处于相对比较理想的状态；而在养殖过程中，环境则是复杂多变的，有时候把我们认为是有损虾健康的因子都除掉，或许并不是好事，马修如何看待这个问题呢？

马修

normally we use probiotics which are mostly comprised of a mixture of bacillus and lactobacillus species - these can help remove toxic ammonia and nitrite, outcompete vibrios and actually kill off bad vibrio species. They thus improve environmental conditions.
some people also brew their own non-pathogenic vibrio strains in the hatchery, but they do not help water quality, only outcompete pathogenic vibrios

翻译：
通常我们使用的益生菌，大多数是由芽孢杆菌和乳酸杆菌，他们可以帮助清除有毒的氨氮和亚硝酸盐，o控制弧菌，改善对虾生长环境。有些孵化场自己培养非致病性弧菌，这样做对水质改善没有帮助，只不过可以对抗致病性弧菌

马修

yes, organic acids can lower pH in fish/shrimp gut from pH 7 to pH 4-5 which can kill pathogenic gram negative bacteria like vibrios, buit does not kill gram positive probiotic bacteria
this is used alot in livestock (pig, chicken) but not much yet in shrimp. But it does work both in hatchery and pond farms

翻译：
是的，有机酸能将虾肠道内的PH从 7降至4-5，可以杀死致病性革兰氏阴性菌如弧菌，但不杀死革兰氏阳性菌。目前很多家畜（猪，鸡）上都在这样使用，虾上用的不多。但它的确在苗场养殖和养殖场都非常有效。

海天一色

还有，现在提倡生态养殖，多使用微生态制剂，但他也有一个问题，在环境适宜时，微生态制剂是优势菌群是益生菌，但在不适条件下，微生态制剂也会带来条件致病菌，这个问题马修博士怎么看呢？您有什么好的建议吗？

逆游的鱼

网友提问：
对于近段时间出现严重的排塘现象，请问应该要如何去处理？是补苗还是不补？怎么补？补什么苗？谢谢

马修

in Chinese hatcheries the main problem is reliance on old ways of management. There does not seem to be much capacity for problem solving.
I think the biggest problem is not using live algae. Live algae must be grown with care so it is not contaminated and then is ideal feed for larvae, but also helps maintain water quality and even reduce vibrios. If it is done badly and poor quality then it is bad, so most Chinese hatcheries do not do it. If done properly it is very good.
the other main problem is a focus on quantity rather than quality. In order to get high quality PL you must focus on quality

翻译：
在中国，主要问题是对于旧的管理方式的过度依赖，似乎没有太多的从解决问题的角度去考虑。我认为最大的问题是不用活藻。而且活藻的培训必须要非常的严格，让它不受污染。活藻不仅是理想的饵料，而且有助于保持水质以及减少弧菌。但是活藻如果培育得不好，质量差，它会带来不好的影响，所以大多数中国孵化场不做。但如果做得好，这对育苗帮助是很好的。另一个主要问题是注重产量不注重质量。想要培训高品质的虾苗你必须关注这一点。

pondplus

海天一色 发表于 2013-6-18 16:31
还有就是如何解决丰年虫的壳带入病原这个问题呢？

这次马修博士在湛江讲课就提到丰年虫携带病原的问题，强烈建议做苗的企业在丰年虫孵化前，需要进行蜕壳处理。这样做1，可以缩短时间；2，提供丰年虫的孵化率；3，减少丰年虫携带弧菌。马修课件里有详细的蜕壳操作流程，有需要可以联系我！

和蟹天然

马修 发表于 2013-6-18 16:32
normally we use probiotics which are mostly comprised of a mixture of bacillus and lactobacillus spe ...

翻译：通常我们使用的益生菌，大多数是由芽孢杆菌和乳酸杆菌，他们可以帮助清除有毒的氨氮和亚硝酸盐，o控制弧菌，改善对虾生长环境。有些孵化场自己培养非致病性弧菌，这样做对水质改善没有帮助，只不过可以对抗致病性弧菌

yulee

pondplus 发表于 2013-6-18 16:38
这次马修博士在湛江讲课就提到丰年虫携带病原的问题，强烈建议做苗的企业在丰年虫孵化前，需要进行蜕壳处 ...

如果能提供真是非常感谢! 邮箱:463790331@qq.com。

逆游的鱼

对于EMS早期的补救都有哪些措施了？

马修

Normally, we only use the broodstock for 4 months as after that they become used up and do not produce good quality nauplius any more. So once we ablate, we use continuously for 4 months, then get a new batch. We do not stop and start with the same batch

和蟹天然

马修 发表于 2013-6-18 16:34
yes, organic acids can lower pH in fish/shrimp gut from pH 7 to pH 4-5 which can kill pathogenic gra ...

翻译：是的，有机酸能将虾肠道内的PH从 7降至4-5，可以杀死致病性革兰氏阴性菌如弧菌，但不杀死革兰氏阳性菌。目前很多家畜（猪，鸡）上都在这样使用，虾上用的不多。但它的确在苗场养殖和养殖场都非常有效。

马修

If you have already got EMS you must stop feeding immediately for 5-7 days then start again slowly after that. You stop feeding to try to improve the environment and help the shrimp recover. also, controlling water quality (with probiotics) and trying to keep algae bloom stable and not allow rapid fluctuations in pH or high pH levels may help. However, sometimes none of this helps and you mjust harvest pond and start again

马修

You are right - the hatchery is controlled and "sterile" environment while the pond fluctuates widely
Normally the PL or even juveniles in the nursery do not suffer from EMS, but when we stock the ponds, immediately they do. Thus the stress of moving them and the stress factors in the ponds obviously affect them very quickly.
Many Asian farmers are used to killing everything in the pond to try to start clean, but if you do that (with chlorine or pesticide) then quickly bacteria will grow back - there is always bacteria - you cannot stop them. so you have to make sure the ones that grow back are non-pathogenic - i.e. add alot of probiotics or heterotrophic bacteria right away during pond preparation otherwise bad bacteria will grow quickly.
One farm in Thailand avoids EMS by not killinbg everything, but fertilizing to produce good bloom of diatoms and zooplankton (copepods) to promote a good environment at it seems to work to avoid EMS


翻译：你是对的。育苗场是相对“无菌”的环境而池塘的环境随时都在变化。因而当我们把苗发到塘中后，他们容易出现EMS，而在这之前不会发生。很明显，我们放苗以及塘中的环境会对他们造成很大的应激。亚洲的许多养殖户在遇到EMS后，就直接清塘，用氯或农药消毒，希望下一造干干净净地开始。但实际上，细菌很快地地又卷土重来了——细菌总是存在的，你不可能阻止。所以你要确保的是塘中存在的细菌是非致病性的，即增加很多益生菌抑制有害菌的生长。在泰国的一个农场，通过促进藻及浮游生物及有益菌地生长，从而维持一个比较好的水质环境。从而很好地预防EMS的问题。

海天一色

现在病害这么严重，有没有什么好的养殖模式？您怎么样国内专家推广的鱼虾混养呢？

海天一色

现在病害这么严重，有没有什么好的养殖模式？您怎么样国内专家推广的鱼虾混养呢？

和蟹天然

马修 发表于 2013-6-18 16:37
in Chinese hatcheries the main problem is reliance on old ways of management. There does not seem to ...

翻译：在中国，主要问题是对于旧的管理方式的过度依赖，似乎没有太多的从解决问题的角度去考虑。我认为最大的问题是不用活藻。而且活藻的培训必须要非常的严格，让它不受污染。活藻不仅是理想的饵料，而且有助于保持水质以及减少弧菌。但是活藻如果培育得不好，质量差，它会带来不好的影响，所以大多数中国孵化场不做。但如果做得好，这对育苗帮助是很好的。另一个主要问题是注重产量不注重质量。想要培训高品质的虾苗你必须关注这一点。

海天一色

在马来西亚的《农牧世界》杂志2013年3月刊上看到：“在水产养殖方面，每周加入1ppm木醋液，可以使水质清洁、提高pH、溶解所投入的制造水色肥料成分。木醋液有效加强鱼虾粪便转化，池水发臭几率几乎不会发生。此外，目前使用木醋液的虾池并无EMS等病害报告。在饲料中添加1%食用木炭粉能使鱼虾饲料在水中的香味持久度提高，增加鱼虾食欲，并帮助消化。”

木醋液始于日本，是树木等有机物的热分解产物，含有200多种有机物成分，功用机制非常复杂，有“因使用方法差异，亦可为药，亦可为毒”的说法。

木醋液可以防EMS？
刚刚看到一个网友的发帖

马修

Shrimp and fish polyculture is very good, as the right species of fish has a very positive effect on the water quality (especially vibrio levels) in the water and sediment, helping the shrimp to fight disease. Many times, the culture is still mostly shrimp (stocked at 50-60/m2) and the fish is just there for improving environment (0.5 fish/m2). Normally herbivorous fish are used which do not east the shrimp - like tilapia or mullet or milkfish. Of course, this means lower stocking density, so less profit, but more sustainable - so long term it is a better strategy and works to prevent diseases like EMS and WSSV and IMNV

淡泊宁静

虽养鱼不养虾，也来顶一下外国朋友